The Art of Trust #3 – Transcript

Fraser Jack
Hello, and welcome back to this series on the art of building trusted relationships. That trust is an unconscious feeling which is felt by somebody. And building trust is complicated. And thanks to the research in this episode number three of our four part series, we hear from our panel of speakers on the third area of trust reliability, let’s get into it. Welcome back to this the third episode in our series on the art of building trust. I’m joined again by Andrew, welcome back.

Andrew Inwood
Great to be here. Thanks for it.

Fraser Jack
Thank you for being here. Now we’re talking about reliability in this episode. Let’s kick it off. What are the traits? And what should advisors be looking at when it comes to reliability.

Andrew Inwood
So reliability, again, is part of that authenticity, that predictability stack of the great for big trust drivers, and it’s one of the most powerful parts of trust based behavior. If you can be relied upon, then then you become a really important part of somebody’s tribe. If you look around your tribe right now, and when I’ve got a tribe, and my close friendship group is about five people, some of whom I love, absolutely, but they are absolutely unreliable, and I wouldn’t expect them to be reliable. And there’s two or three of them who are completely reliable. And the joke question that I have amongst my friendship group is if you’ve killed someone, and you’ve got a body to bury, who do you call, and, and you’re always secretly pleased when one of your friends is what I call you. And you think that yeah, I’d call you too. And sometimes you think I wouldn’t call you a unicycle it’s but anyway, I still love you. So this concept of where you fit in a network, particularly for providing advice, if you can fit into the bucket of completely reliable, trades away all sorts of other outcomes, you don’t have to be a genius. If you’re reliable, you don’t have to be hitting the best possible returns if you’re a level because reliable reliability is absolutely critical people to particularly at times of stress, who’s part of the network that you can trust, through reliable and reliable integrate into the network at a time when it comes. So there’s all sorts of clues to reliability, which is really important to understand. There’s absolutely small clues. One of the great things that is going on at the moment, one of my I have a couple advisors because I’m lucky enough to have core data in different countries around the world and have an advisor in the UK. My adviser in the UK text me on Wednesday, every morning at 10am. That’s about to a minute in the sorry, it’s 10pm and almost in Australia, and I get the text and as I know it’s an automated service because I helped him set it up. But it’s a really intimate thing that I get from Philip, every week on Wednesday saying, hey, just touching base. This is what’s happened over in the markets. This is what’s going on this is what we’ve done is we’re technically in a managed account with him because even though they don’t call it that over them, that’s what’s going on. It’s really intimate because it’s a text and it’s just hey, just touching base. This is just normal if what you’re done, and it’s kind of pushed him into a really reliable spot in our brain. Phillip tends to text every Wednesday before 11am It tends to be respond by text. He has a bunch of automated systems, even if this automated system is saying I’m out of the office, I’m skiing, which is the last one I got from him. I’ll be in I’ll be back to you as quickly as Petrus Griffin in the meantime, I’m not the office called Georgia. This is a telephone number. So he’s really reliable on all those small things and it tends to build up to belief that the person is reliable a lot of small things is going to be reliable on the big things as well. So in the way that reliability works is that you tend to leave a bunch of clues. I’ll give you an example of something which isn’t reliable. I just had a meeting with someone that was supposed to be at 11 o’clock today, and he was half an hour late. He’s wants me to provide a service to Him. But I left after waiting for 20 minutes, because I know what the future looks like with its sky, everything’s gonna be half an hour late, everything’s gonna be on his terms, he won’t be forming a partnership with me, he’ll be kind of exploring the relationship. And if prepared to be half an hour late for a meeting, which he called and he organized, et cetera, et cetera, then the future is very uncertain. I mean, if you’ve been 10 minutes later, even if he’d responded to a text and say, I’m stuck, I’m going to be half an hour late any of those things with work. So I’ve literally given up business because I don’t want to work with someone who’s unreliable, it’s just not worth it. And I know what the future looks like, is such a critical indicator of what success is, and what’s going on. Really interesting a bit bit about this is there’s a huge amount of evidence and a lot of this evidence is really old, that you can build systems, which make your process reliable. And if you build those systems, then your business becomes easy to work with easy to buy, and easy to understand. And people with reliable systems have a much higher tolerance to price. So it’s a quality, it’s a it’s an integer for quality and quality as an integer for high price.

Fraser Jack
Yeah, well, that’s really cool. And obviously the the opposite of those you just mentioned, the, the opposite is is unreliability. Now, I wanted to ask you a little bit about this stacking of that reliability versus the stacking of unreliability, because it seems like you only have to be unreliable once or twice. And that’s the end of it. Whereas the reliability can take more, more more occasions?

Andrew Inwood
Well, it’s a very interesting thing. So the minimum reliability equations is three, right? And this is actually something that the Greeks knew about, and they call it the Trust Bank, you had to build deposits in the Trust Bank, before you could ask a question of somebody, you had to build a right to ask for someone to support you. And they, they were literally talking about the ability to call on another tribe if they were attacked by somebody else. So they wanted to build a relationship with the Spartans, or the Athenians or the cretins or somebody else, because they were constantly getting attacked by people, and they want to be able to go and say, Hey, we need your help. You know, Philip of Macedon is coming down the coast, and we need about 600. Guys, are you prepared to spend 600 guys to die on the Hill for us, and you had to build that reliability in that relationship, because they needed to be able to call on you to be able to do the same thing. It’s kind of part of reciprocity and wanting the same thing. So none of this is new. And they said that they were prepared to have three positive integers before they’re able to even ask the question. So before they were able to even go and say to them, Hey, we need 300 guys to be able to deliver on this. There’s so many great examples of that from history that it’s not even fastened

Fraser Jack
minimum of three, but as many as possible. And then, of course, with the unreliability

Andrew Inwood
Yeah, think of it as a multiplier of three. So once you’ve had one bad experience, it’s you know, has the weight of three, I mean, they go back, you gotta go back to the beginning, you got to start again, and build it up again, and it’s gonna take years, and you’re gonna have to accept that you’re gonna have to, you’re going to have to give a lot of way to build that reliability again. But you know, it’s a process,

Fraser Jack
I was just thinking that you start with, you probably start at a point of neutral, right, and then you get to build three, and there, but if you get an unreliability, you go into the negatives.

Andrew Inwood
Yeah, McDonald’s have a version of it, which they train into all their managers, and they’re probably the best in the world. They call it the Trust Bank. So they’re constantly looking for making deposits in the Trust Bank. And it’s a really interesting part. Because if you if you look at that McDonald’s training, and I was watching it online, because it’s a bit of a cult, and I was trying to understand how they do it, and how they get people to basically give a percentage of their income to build a property Empire, which I thought this is really interesting, right? How these guys have convinced this, these guys to do it. And they’re kind of they’re constantly working, you’re putting deposits and people’s trust bank so that they can sort of do it and make sure those things happen. The really interesting part is that when people betray that trust, and then they give that trust away, when we tend to fumble it away in the advice industry. Let me give you an example of that. I think advisors do a lot for their clients, and they don’t tell them about it. They’re constantly making adjustments working on the systems and their processes and thinking about investing time and, and they never asked for payment for that. So I think we’ve got to be able to sort of talk about that more. I think that the way Philip sends a message every Wednesday, literally telling me he’s done something for me, builds deposits in that Trust Bank all the time and mimics that idea of reliability is actually quite a relatable person is an accountant by background and it’s very straightforward, but but making sure that you’re constantly building those deposits is important. So if you’re letting a year go pass without building reliability deposits with your customers three or four to five to six times, then that’s a bad thing. If you’re not building that programmatically into the relationship, then you’re living in opportunity going to go past and if you’re not actually being authentic about their reliability, then you’re literally a fraud.

Fraser Jack
Yep, exactly. Right now change is a big part of a process of any business and how does reliability and chain means work together or against each other.

Andrew Inwood
Yeah, that’s so that’s really confronting some, I don’t work with businesses, but I’m watching a lot of advice businesses go through fundamental change in terms of process and doing all those things, I think you have to be really candid, that change is painful. And that change there is going to there are going to be misspoke. mistakes made and things are going to be harder than they seem for a little while. So you have to be really careful about communicating change in what you’re prepared to accept and do a few other things. For example, we’re just moving to taking some of the research that we do and turning it into a short videos explaining it to the customer. So they don’t actually have to read 300 pages of data. And we did, we recorded our first one last week, and it was terrible. And authentically terrible, authentic. That’s 100%, right. And I said to the team, we know the first one is going to be terrible. We’re just learning the process of how to do this. So let’s do six before we start looking at quality, let’s just get the process, right, get the editing, right and build up a process and improve, improve, improve it. So we’ve gone through six by the end of August. I don’t think they’ll ever see the light of day I certainly have the first one never sees the light of day because I was the person on the video. But the reality is that we’ve got to build the process, right, when we can make it reliable. And then we can actually do it at scale before we go anywhere. So I mean, I know everyone was disappointed with the first one. But that’s not the point. The point is to go through the process to get it right and work on doing six before we start looking at quality. Yeah, that’s true of everyone going through change. And you have to be able to communicate that really clearly this is going to hurt, but it’s better for us. And it’s really important. So you’ve hit on something that I haven’t really thought about a lot. But it’s certainly true that as a species, we’re addicted to transformation, right. And transformation is a really important part of who we are. We’re transforming our businesses, we’re transforming ourselves. We’re transforming our customers lives. And we have to be really clear about that and do it authentically and reliably. And when we’re doing things which are causing change, we have to acknowledge the pain, acknowledge the time and acknowledge that it’s not going to be perfect. And that imperfection will increase over time. Yeah, that’s

Fraser Jack
exactly right. And I think you should release those videos just by the way because they’ve been creates a bit of a bit of an anchor for the for the rest of the videos as they get better.

Andrew Inwood
I’ve learned something about myself. During this phase, I learned that what I look good in is the past and the dark.

Fraser Jack
I love I love the comment, just off topic that everybody says that, you know, they were here as a photo of me when I was younger, as opposed to every other photo of them.

Andrew Inwood
Yeah, no one really wants to obviously don’t have

Fraser Jack
15 year old. Thank you so much for chatting to us about reliability, I look forward to catching you in the next episode where we really start talking about the feeling that somebody is acting in your best interest. I’m looking forward to joining. Thank you for coming back to us and talking about reliability. Welcome back to the conversation. Hi, Fraser.

Jane Ryan
Thanks for having me.

Fraser Jack
You’re very welcome. Now, tell us a little bit about some of the behaviors within your business, around reliability and how reliability is something that builds trust.

Jane Ryan
Look, I really communicate with the clients that if they if there’s something they want to talk to me about, if there’s a question they’ve got, and it’s 10 o’clock at night, I’m happy for them to shoot me a text or send me an email because I didn’t have the notifications up on my phone. Because they then say, I don’t want to wake you up, or I don’t want to disturb you and I explained I didn’t have the notifications to ding on my phone. So it’s important that they can feel that they can tap into to my knowledge or to tap into their relationship with me. You know, if they’ve got a question, or there’s something that worries them, if it’s, if it’s stopping them from sleeping, I’m happy for them to shoot the information through to me. And and that, you know, I can look at that, look at the message, look at the email, answer the phone call, and and come back to them with with an answer with a response. I think that’s important. And it’s important to set expectations and timelines, obviously, in regional, you know, regional New South Wales, when I’m going from one place to another, you know, I might go and see some clients that are three hours away. And then if we’re talking about, if it’s a new client, or even an existing client, and we’re looking at maybe doing some changes, that’s going to take me some time to get back to the office, to have all of go through our compliance steps, make sure that, that we’re that we’re doing everything that we need to be doing, and to come back and provide some advice on that. So you know, I might say to some pebbles, six weeks before I’m back in front of you. And these are the reasons why I think it’s important that you explain if it’s about reliability, and it’s a short period of time, or it’s a long period of time, this is why I can and can’t do that. So I think setting that timeline out and obviously you know COVID Did slow a lot of things down for a lot of people in different ways. So it’s about going back and say look, I know potentially initially it was This timeline, but you know, it’s going to be this because we’re still waiting on this answer or so I think it’s just communicating that that information about about that.

Fraser Jack
Yeah. So really, really leaning into the communicating the setting of expectations, I guess, and allowing that people have got that expectation of one thing, and then, you know, you’re I guess you you’re trying to out deliver what you talk to them about?

Jane Ryan
Yeah, that’s right. And look, you know, recently, I sort of had a bit of a hurdle my, my sister passed away unexpectedly about six weeks ago. So that sort of threw, threw me out a little bit in in lots of ways. And so it was important that I just went back to, to some people and said, Look, this is what’s happened, I just need to make you aware of what’s happened, we’re going to have to reset that timeline. And of course, everyone was very, very understanding and sympathetic about it, which is very nice. And that then goes back into our previous conversation about showing vulnerability, you know, that, as an advisor, and a professional, and someone that’s running a business, there are all these glass balls that we’ve that we’re juggling and not wanting to drop, and it’s about showing that you’re not superhuman that you, you know, you can go back to them and say, Look, this has happened. And then, you know, a week later, I got COVID. So that sort of threw me out a little bit again. So you just go in, you communicate that information that this is what’s happened, this is what we’re looking at for a timeline, and people are completely fine about that.

Fraser Jack
Yeah, amazing. Obviously, reliability, we think about showing up every single time. But, you know, it’s not always about that. It’s about saying, leaning into the concept that if you can’t, you want to get in front of that, and say, you know, show your vulnerability and reset the expectations. Tell me a little bit about the reliability piece over time, you know, like building trust over time, and how those relationships develop.

Jane Ryan
Look, I’ve always had the philosophy that trust isn’t and it shouldn’t be demanded, and it shouldn’t be expected. And it takes time to build trust. So that’s something that I always with new clients, I’m explained to them that this is a two way street when we’re, when we’re meeting and you know, they’re sort of interviewing me to see if I’m the right advisor for them. And I’m interviewing them to see if, if they’re the sort of client that fits into my space that, you know, we’re going to jail well. And so I think that setting that expectation, setting, all of all of the information out on the table is very important. And trust is earned over time. And I have clients who will outright say, Yes, I trust you. And I said, That’s really great. But I still need you to understand, I’m going to explain what we’re doing. Because at the end of the day, this is your money, this is your pathway, I’m just here walking along with you holding your hand. So that’s a, it’s a lovely compliment. But in in the same sense, they still need to have an absolute understanding of what we’re doing and why we’re doing that. And so I continue to repeat those conversations over and over with the clients year after year or appointment after appointment, because that is what’s important. And it’s also about me trying to gain an understanding into what they think and how they work and how they manage their money. Because it may be, for example, that I’m managing their superannuation and investment portfolio, for example, and maybe insurance that we’ve done over a period of time, and we’re continuing to reject that. But I also want to understand how they manage their day to day money. And if they don’t need my help, that’s fine. I don’t, you know, I don’t push myself into that space. But if I get a sense that someone is potentially not managing their cash flow as well, I will just continue to encourage them to lean on me if they need help in that space, because we can make success and great results out of some of this, these other places with the superannuation and the investments. But if they feel day to day that their money isn’t that they’re not managing their money well, and they don’t really, they don’t know where to turn to or they don’t know how to ask or they, they feel that they should know when they don’t know enough. That’s important that I can gain their trust so that we can actually get a handle on that. Because if you’re not managing that day to day money, well, that can be quite stressful, and it’s an unnecessary stress.

Fraser Jack
Yeah, absolutely. such it’s such a big part of it. Jane, thank you for being part of this particular episode. I look forward to catching you in the Next one and really getting a little bit deeper into that concept of acting in somebody’s or the feeling that somebody is acting in the in your best interest. Thanks, Fraser. Anthony, welcome back to this third episode. Thank you. Now we are tackling the concept of reliability in this episode, tell us a little bit about obviously, your, you know, your businesses 4040 odd years old, and you’ve been there for half of that, tell us a little bit about what reliable reliability means to you and your business?

Anthony Jones
Well, I think the most important thing is always been there for clients when they need us. That’s probably the number one thing because that’s, that’s, I guess, why we operate, that’s what we’re here for. Almost a stickler for being on time. So and when we sort of turn up to, you know, if I turn up to a client’s house, I’m visiting them, I’m probably one of these people, I’d be half an hour early, rather than one minute late. So you know, I might sit out, but I’ll also not go in early as well, that can be just as much inconvenience, being five minutes early, might be finishing dinner, or, you know, kids to bed or whatever that you might be doing. So you know, you can use that time to, you know, call someone else or do something else. But I think you know, being on time and you know, if you say I’m going to be there at such and such, that sort of demonstrates that reliability, I’ve had number of people say, almost opened the door right at nine o’clock or something that goes you’re walking sort of up the stairs. So I think that’s that’s a really important thing that we can do for people. So. But I think also too, when you get through that, going through the process, I think when sort of clearly explaining to person, the different steps are going to happen, the timeframe it’s going to take for that to happen, and then delivering on it. Yeah, the number one thing we we hear from clients that they may have had another advisor in the past is, oh, we never heard from them. You know, we didn’t know what was happening. We rang up three months later, and they said are by no, we haven’t done this yet. I’ve done that. And I think that just puts people off. I know for ourselves. I mean, we just got some little bit worked out at home, on a wall. And you know, this was the best tradesman, I think we’ve ever had he, they turned up, you didn’t even know they were there. After they left at the end of the day. They turned up on time every morning, they actually rang the say, Hey, we’re here. Absolutely incredible, which is not something you always talk about with, with a tradesperson. And I think you know, relaying that back to sort of, we need to be the same, we need to be that person that was a lot reliable, we always get back to clients within 24 hours, you can always talk to someone in our office, not a machine. So I think they’re really, really important things to instill confidence, because there’s nothing worse than bringing leaving a message. And then the next minute, you’re saying, Well, I wonder if they’ve actually got that message here

Fraser Jack
the competence things really interesting, isn’t it? I like the idea of always turning up early and then never really setting yourself up. Taking that moment to sit right what am I what am I gonna do here? What the meeting is, you know, maybe getting getting yourself prepped for the meeting? And, you know, obviously, yes, doing what you say you’re going to do. And, and having those things communication is a big part of that, isn’t it just making sure you go a decent communication system?

Anthony Jones
Absolutely. And it’s, it’s a case of an end communication to me. And I think where a lot of, well, maybe not so much newer advisors, but younger advisors that we’ve had through the place have fallen down is that I keep saying in email is not a relationship building exercise. Just because you’ve email someone doesn’t mean you’ve actually done the job, ring them, you need to use the phone, you need that personal communication. And again, a quick phone call can often say is, you know, a lot of time, and also gives you that opportunity just to have a chat to someone is anything you know, what’s happening, et cetera, et cetera. And so I think that’s, that, to me, is the absolute key. You know, we all get so many emails, but you know, there’s nothing like getting a phone call. You know, I think you respond a lot more positively to a phone call these days, this is probably unusual, it’s unusual, you know, not to have to push 15 buttons to actually get through to someone or so you know, from that point of view, we’re just trying to get people I guess, the old fashioned experience where you actually turn up or you’d speak to someone, you know, the prior to emails and those sorts of things. So

Fraser Jack
it’s funny is that emails have sort of lost their personality?

Anthony Jones
Well, I think you get so many now that it’s, it’s, I think it makes us less efficient, as much as it’s, it’s, it’s good when at work when you need it. But it’s terribly inefficient. And I always said, if we could just have advisors, if we could get rid of the emails, life would be like that have better relationships with clients, clients would be happier. Everything would be great. Yeah, I mean, I often, you know, and I think one of the key things that that we often do, and it’s a good way to get referrals without actually asking is enough, I’m driving to an appointment. And people say why don’t you know we only have clients come to our office. Why do you go and see them? Well, I actually use the time in the car. I actually have a list of clients and I just ring some ring Definitely from time to time just to say hello. And probably the last two, I rang in the last probably, you know, say a month ago, or so both of them said, I’m glad you actually rang us, I’ve just been thinking I was just been talking to my sister or such and such they need to find a financial advisor. So using that time just to ring someone without any requirement. You know, from that point of view, is worth its weight in gold as well. So,

Fraser Jack
yeah, fantastic. Thank you so much for being on this particular particular episode. I look forward to catching you in the final episode. Right. Thanks. And folks, thank you for joining me again,

Anne Fuchs
Raisa. Good to see you. Good to see you, sir.

Fraser Jack
We’re in we’re in we’re recording in real life. Like we’re here to talk about reliability in this particular episode of our series of building the art of building trust. Talk to me a little bit about how, how important is reliability and being able to show up when you say you’re gonna show up?

Anne Fuchs
It’s the basic, isn’t it? Right, like nobody loses. So I always joke here at work. I don’t like surprises unless they involve a Zimmerman dress and a bottle of Verve otherwise, and our members certainly don’t appreciate the surprises when it comes to administration, or investment performance in the lock. No, no, we did some research recently, where I think it was close to 65% of our members said really their super fund most important thing is that security and reliability and that it’s the money is safe.

Fraser Jack
Yeah, really interesting word safe, isn’t it? Because often, we’re talking about growing money that we’re talking about safe is the number one priority. And you

Anne Fuchs
can see that in the behavior when markets, you know, when markets are going up so much people go oh, there’s sort of just trouble along not thinking but you advise us now and we saw it, you know, we’ve seen it so much in recent years. And I think we’re going to really face into it in the next couple of years with the investment climate we might be heading into is the moment that they see something on the news, and they think their money’s not safe, they get really nervous, which is why this trust factor of I trust my advisor to act in my best interest. So we in that research we did 82% of the members that we research said that is the fundamentally the most important thing and then that that money is safe. And so yeah, they work really hard. If you think about what you’re you work hard, I work hard SGS going in near it, you know. And so it’s really precious, and they just worry about it managing. And so the institution where the money’s invested is equally as important as the advisor, the advisor is going to look after it and the and the way they’ve invested that money is also safe.

Fraser Jack
Yep, yep. And what are some of the ways that we can as advisors start building reliable that reliability or building that trust?

Anne Fuchs
We’ve spoken about it in the other episodes, isn’t it? It’s around transparency, it’s around talking their language, not using the jargon, making sure. Informed consent and understanding is something obviously advisors as we become a profession talk about a lot. But we if you do that really well, that’s going to create an environment when markets do tank, that hopefully the advisor is not fielding phone calls because the client is second guessing, because they didn’t really understand in the first place. They really do know and trust, because they understand. And that is that transparency factor.

Fraser Jack
Yep. Yep, show up and keep showing. Yeah, insight.

Anne Fuchs
Yeah. And it’s the simple things. If someone says, I’m going to I’m going to call you or I’m going to email you, and then they don’t, firstly, you know, the first time maybe there’s some understanding of something might have gone wrong, then the next time, there’s a trend, I’m disappointed, they’ll let me and then eventually there is just this person, I don’t trust that that word is not good for anything. And so it’s really the simple things. Getting them right,

Fraser Jack
yeah. Now, I want to talk about the concept of, you know, like, businesses having years of experience, for example, we’ve talked a little bit in the past about the, the rebranding of the two businesses come together. And then and for those advisors, that might be in a long established business, that’s probably easier to start demonstrating that long term reliability, but for new businesses, it’s difficult. You guys have been through a rebrand. We’ve We’ve starting a new brand, I guess, tell us about the idea of reliability and how you bring those two together to fall into the new brand. And I think yeah,

Anne Fuchs
that’s a good question. Because between the two funds is 140 years of history there but if you’ve seen the new ad, big baby comes out because it’s the you know, there’s we can start a fresh and I think if you’re a practitioner, if you’re a young advisor, starting an established firm, you can again play that well, I’m, I am new, but I mean, this established infrastructure with the with the systems and processes in place, but equally I know some great advisors that have been employed for big institutions, that advisors that have gone out on their own. Were super exciting. So they don’t necessarily have all the infrastructure but they can demonstrate they’ve already got that relight thing they use an authenticity which we’ve spoken about and a confidence and that lack of pretense and how they communicate. So when I feel like the You know, proving the reliability isn’t required because their bedside manner is just oozes, you know, gives the client confidence this person knows what they’re talking about.

Fraser Jack
Yep. And we talked about authenticity before. And I think if you are authentic to yourself, then you can create that consistency of, of who you are than having difficulty trying,

Anne Fuchs
and not trying to be everything to everyone. So I think the advisors that I, and I speak, I’ve spoken about them a lot, who inspire me just have a real clarity around, I can’t be everything to everyone. Because if you try to be everything to everyone, you’re going to inevitably fail and those systems will not be reliable. So having a turnkey approach to look, I, I work best with people who are in like, there are firms that specialize in public service, Queensland Government, there are firms that specialize in particular mining company out in the region, and they just know everything about that client or prospective client. So again, it just makes sure that some date they know what they’re talking about, they can demonstrate that knowledge they can demonstrate they’ll be acting in the client’s best interest. And, and it just creates that safe environment. So the clients not feeling worried. Yeah,

Fraser Jack
I feel like the advisors you talking about are the ones that can know what’s happening to the client before the client knows.

Anne Fuchs
Well, that’s, that’s perfect. That’s perfection, isn’t it? So, you know, we’re thinking about in terms of what we do next, and how can we develop our systems so we can help the advisors tell them what’s happening in their client portfolios before anyone so that they can get ahead of it? You know, it’s super funds haven’t historically worked with financial advisors really well, super funds, always, you know, the industry funds have been an employee member dynamic. But I think recognizing that these external financial advisors actually have the trust. It’s the members that trust them, and we just see year upon year and more and more people looking to and these are again or not, well, you know, they’re not high net worth people, but they’re paying three grand four grand for retirement planning advice, because they trust this person, because and that trust is something that’s got to be respected. And we’ve got to honor that.

Fraser Jack
Anne thanks for so much for joining us. In this episode, we speak about reliability. Let’s let’s catch up on the next episode when we’re talking about the feeling that clouds get when someone is acting in their best interest.

Anne Fuchs
What a beautiful idea. Let’s do that.